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Post by corky21 on Feb 27, 2009 8:55:10 GMT -5
Can someone tell me what a normal prolactin, LH, FSH level should be. Mine have fluctuated. Don't they normally fluctuate per your cycle?
I had a prolactin level of 6.5 on day 15 of cycle (4.79-23.30) and then 6.3 on day 21
LH 36.4 (Day 15) FSH 62.5 (Day 15)
LH 23.3 (Day 21) FSH 19.5 (Day 21)
Not sure how the Phases go so here are all the ranges:
LH Follicular 2.4-12.6 Midcycle 14.0-95.6 Luteal 1.0-11.4 Postmenopause 7.7-58.5
FSH Follicular 3.5-12.5 Midcycle 4.7-21.5 Luteal 1.7-7.7 Postmenopause 25.8-134.8
Also on the progesterone: Day 15 was 0.41 Day 21 they didn't test it, not sure why, must have forgot
Follicular 0.2-1.5 Ovulation phase 0.8-3.0 Luteal 1.7-27.0 Postmenopause 0.1-0.8
I also supplement every day estriol 1mg and estradiol .50mg and Progesterone 200mg for 14 days. I start the progesterone on day 14 of cycle too. I was irregular for several months but when those number were taken on day 21 it was exactly 7 days b/f I got a period. And the numbers for day 15 were pretty accurate b/c I did get a cycle about 10 days later, but only lasted 2 days. Also the numbers for Day 15 I had been on 200mg progesterone for 2 days and I had taken the progesterone the night before the test.
So what do the levels suggest? I'm trying to figure out if the LH, FSH and Prolactin are normal b/c my ACTH test was abnormal. I want to get an idea of what pituitary hormones are off.
Thank you.
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Post by fractal1 on Feb 28, 2009 15:07:19 GMT -5
Hi Corky, Elevated LH and FSH levels suggests that your pituitary is fine (with regards to LH and FSH secretion) but the ovaries are shutting down. If you are young this is classified as premature ovarian failure (POF); if you are a little older it is pre/menopause. Cheers
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Post by corky21 on Mar 1, 2009 9:40:06 GMT -5
Since my LF and FSH seem to be mid level to high at times in the last year on several tests, then that it why my gynecologist suggested bio HRT for my symptoms. Because it shows perimenopause; ovaries going into decline. That would also explain the skipping cycles. Okay, so I took the bio HRT, but I didn't notice much change except for a little better mood. I was still getting loss of temple hair, muscle pain, chills, low body temperature. Then I had the thyroid sonogram and found the complex cysts and nodules. Then the blood work which everyone here said my low ACTH and low T4 show that I am hypopit.
So if the LH, and FSH are normal, then the pituitary is normal. So how can I be hypopit with just one test of the ACTH?
Isn't it possible that supplementing hormones can lower your adrenals b/c the adrenals may stop producing some of those hormones b/c they are coming from the outside?
I'm trying to figure out about the low ACTH. From what I've read if the ACTH is low and the cortisol is low than it is usually a pituitary problem. If the ACTH is high and cortisol high it is just an adrenal problem. If the ACTH is high and cortisol is low, again just an adrenal problem.
So if my other pituitary hormones are normal except for just the ACTH, I shouldn't be having a pituitary problem. Also my TSH was at a normal level of 1.5 (even though we don't go by that for hypothyroid symptoms), but still it's not way, way low or way high. So the only one is the ACTH.
Could it be b/c I have been using bio HRT that the ACTH is lower than normal? And my cortisol was 17 and I know many people here say it needs to be 20, but a lot of what I've read said a level of 10 or under in blood serum cortisol is considered mild cortisol deficiency and anything under 5 more severe.
I'm taking the Armour and the HC and I don't feel much different. Granted I'm only on 1 grain and 10mg HC, but I don't feel worse either. I'm losing more hair since starting the Armour.
Since the other pituitary hormones are in normal levels, then I would say I am not secondary adrenal and I don't need to take the medication forever.
As for thyroid. I continued to have low thyroid symptoms while on the bio HRT. I had the classic symptoms, but those can also be estrogen dominance. It's hard to figure that out by blood labs b/c they change constantly, so kind of have to go by symptoms. My T4 was .96 and I realize that is kind of low, so I'm going to stay a bit longer on this Armour, but maybe I just need to tweek my bio HRT?
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Post by justaustin on Mar 1, 2009 14:45:05 GMT -5
"Since the other pituitary hormones are in normal levels, then I would say I am not secondary adrenal and I don't need to take the medication forever. "
That's false Corky. If ACTH is low and cortisol is low, that points to secondary adrenal insufficiency.
Again, YOU CAN BE HYPOPIT WITH ONE DEFICIENT PIT HORMONE. Just because your other hormones may appear "normal" does not rule out secondary adrenal insufficiency.
Your prolactin level is low Reference range. Mine is about your level. I produced no breast milk. Did you have problems with lactation?
Thyroid hormones bind with estrogen. As you increase HRT(estrogen, DHEA /which can convert to estrogen), your frees will likely drop.
Laurie
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Post by corky21 on Mar 1, 2009 19:06:40 GMT -5
Really. I didn't know that. I was reading an endocrinology medical book the other day on all these illnesses and I'm sure it said that for the pituitary to be affected all the pituitary hormones would be off in some way. I didn't breast feed b/c I went right back on an Rx medication but believe me I had plenty in there; I had to wear a really small bra and wrap myself in tight ace bandages and I was still in pain and leaking for awhile. Although in the summer right after I started the bio HRT I had some fluid leaking and drying up on my breasts and I freaked out and thought I had cancer, but it never happened again. Weird. I figured it must be the bios.
As for the binding thing. When I started using the bio HRT I noticed my symptoms remained and may have gotten a bit worse. That is why after 5 months I figured I had to have some type of thyroid issue. So by me taking the estradiol it lowers my free levels? And to feel good I need higher levels of the free T4 and T3?
If this is what is happening then most women going through the changes that have symptoms are having them b/c their estrogen and progesterone move around either to high or too low and if the estrogen is too high for awhile it would bind with the thyroid frees and then give them these low thyroid symptoms. Do you think? Maybe I should just take progesterone for awhile and ditch my estradiol? Although at my last blood test my estradiol was way low at 27 and the time before it was 627 and i use the same dose every day. Very hard to figure out.
TY for the advice.
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Post by justaustin on Mar 2, 2009 17:28:44 GMT -5
The endocrinology "professionals" were referencing Panhypopituitary (deficiency with all pit hormones).
Again, being deficient in one pit hormone would make you hypopit.
You likely felt worse on HRT because thyroid hormones bind with estrogen. Increased estrogen results in increased binding...thus resulting in decreased free thyroid hormone levels.
I'm not experienced with adjusting hormone doses.
Laurie
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Post by corky21 on Mar 10, 2009 16:44:51 GMT -5
So when I started adding even that small dose of estrogen my thyroid type symptoms got worse. It was around month 3 or so that I started thinking I was estrogen dominant and somehow screwing with the thyroid, but I was told my blood tests and symptoms were low estrogen. So I continue even today with the estrogen b/c it has gotten rid of my rages.
So if the estrogen is causing thyroid binding, then I need much more Armour from the outside if I'm going to continue with the Estrogen therapy? Is that right? My goofy holistic doctor still has me on 1 grain for almost 3 months now. I went to see him after the first 4 weeks and he asked how do you feel, and I said not much better, but not worse, status quo, so he said I was to add an OTC Adrenal support and stay on 10HC. Then after the second month I went back and he said, how do you feel? And I said, my hair thinning is getting worse, and he asked if I was still cold and I said yes, but he said to stay on the 1 grain, 10HC and OTC and he ordered some blood tests. Now at the end of month 3 I go back next week to see if he will finally say to increase everything. Geez.
Interesting thing. I finally threw in the towel and went to a chiro for all my disc/muscle pains. She also found some disc problem in my mid back and she said the disc that is affected has a nerve that leads directly to the adrenals. Then I told her all about my thyroid/adrenal thing and she said it could be from the injury to the head, or that disc in the back. She also found in the xray some discs that are calcified and fused together. She said it was from an old injury, years in the making, whiplash. I said, I never had car accident, but got hit with a baseball bat. She said, that's whiplash that'll do it. Then she said those discs also affect the thyroid. Hmmm? Interesting.
I just hope next week he increases me. I won't know if it will help unless I try, right?
So frustrating.
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